Retail Therapy Vs Real Security

SPEAKER_00 0:00

It just was like, Oh wow, screw it. I'm I'm broke. I can't pay the bills anyway. I might as well buy it. I might as well have it. It'll make me happy. And it it never does. I mean the retail therapy is fun for a minute, you know. But when I'm making money and I'm not behind on bills and and there's extra money, it it's addictive to save it too. I never thought it would be a thing. Uh you know, I've I've got money I could spend right now, but I don't have a clue what I'd buy. You know, it's just it's just a different relationship. We became debt-free uh three years ago at 55. We own our house. We have a five-acre farm. We own that, we own our vehicles. We own everything. It's it's it's incredible. I don't know what that that's like. But my car is also 11 years old. But I service it. I keep it on the road. I don't care about a new car. I would much rather not have that big, fat, huge car payment every month. You know, you gotta take what you want in life.

Starting Over At Midlife

SPEAKER_01 0:56

Welcome back to Plan Like a Box. I'm your host, Tony Lost. And today I'm talking with someone whose story is proof. That's starting over at 45 means starting to craft. And we have to open the door to writing public speed data and multiple screen setting out of tests. Today, we're talking about what it really looks like to build a business out of the 70s, figure things out as you go and create financial independence in the second half of your life. Sarah, welcome to the show. I'm so excited to have you here today.

SPEAKER_00 1:41

Thanks for having me, Tanya. That was a great, great intro.

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Awesome.

Divorce Shock And Housing Fear

SPEAKER_01 1:45

Well, take us back to when you were 40. You were going through a divorce, raising a child, and suddenly you needed to figure out how to support yourself. What did look life look like for you at that point?

SPEAKER_00 1:56

Incredibly stressful. Uh, you know, I can look back now and I can see the blessings that I have. At the time, it it was crazy. Um, I think I always knew that I was not gonna stay in that marriage forever. I married when I was 18, had my first baby at 18, had three kids by 26. But, you know, we were young. And I how much do you know about a person at 18, really? Uh so I just I guess I just kind of knew that once the kids were gone that I was not gonna still be in that marriage. However, I did not plan the divorce when it hit. I just knew that one day it was gonna happen. So yeah, the day that the words were out of my mouth, it was like, uh-uh, what do I do now? Because I wasn't it's not like I had a savings account saved or a job lined up. I mean, I yeah. It just happened. So I went into it very broke and uh definitely flying by the seat of my pants.

SPEAKER_01 2:55

Oh, that had to have been so scary.

SPEAKER_00 2:58

Honestly, it really was. I think the hardest thing was trying to find a place to live because I knew I mean I had a part-time job. I had side hustles, I always had side hustle. Um, I knew what I could afford. And when I went and looked at what was available to me to rent in that price range, I was mortified. You know, and my my daughter was 14. Last one left in the house, she wouldn't even go inside to look some of the houses. They were so bad, you know. So yeah, I was terrified. I'm like, what am I gonna do?

SPEAKER_01 3:27

Oh wow.

Learning eBay The Cheap Way

SPEAKER_01 3:28

Now, how did you get the idea to start buying and reselling things online? It was there like a particular moment when you're like, hey, maybe I can make money doing this?

SPEAKER_00 3:39

Sort of kinda not not really. Um I cleaned houses for for 20 years. The first 20 years of my marriage, I yeah, I had a cleaning business. I hated it. I hated it with every ounce of my being, but we needed the money. And and it worked around my kids' schedules, you know, so so I did it. Well, there was a big move when my kids were, well, when two of the kids were entering high school, and I said, you know what, I'm not doing it anymore. I'm I'm I'm not cleaning houses anymore. I I'm done. I can't clean another toilet. Yeah, I'm done. So I still had to come up with something. So I was working at the school part-time, out on the playground, still available for the kids. And my sister was the one that brought up eBay because she said, you know, maybe you'd be good at this. I think they I think that you have a shot. And eBay was kind of new. So I'm like, uh, you're you're crazy. I don't know anything about anything. What would I know to buy and sell? You know, and my first buying and selling attempt was a complete disaster. So I kind of like, yeah, she's crazy. My sister's lost her marbles. Um, but then I started to go to auctions with friends, kind of like a, I don't know, kind of like a social thing, I guess. And things that started to be left on the table that nobody wanted, two, three dollars. I'm like, well, ps, what am I losing? It's two or three bucks. And so I'd buy it, bring it home, let people bid on it and see what happened. And so that's kind of how it started. Um, I think I was probably three years in as a hobby before I was thrown to the wolves and had to make a decision whether I was gonna get like a real job or push harder.

SPEAKER_01 5:11

Gotcha. And when did you realize that that wasn't just a way to make a little extra money, but something that could actually support you?

SPEAKER_00 5:18

I was having surprising success. Um, I I I didn't lose a whole lot of money because I wasn't leaving a whole lot of money on the table. There wasn't a whole lot to lose. If I lost two or three bucks, so what? You know, but I was selling enough of those cheap items for impressive amounts that I'm like, you know, that this isn't too bad. I was enjoying having the extra money. It was helping out with the bills and whatnot. Um, but when I got divorced, it just came down to, okay, do I really want to go get a factory job, a 95, when I know that if I step it up, I have a better chance of producing more money doing this than I would starting at an entry-level factory job. Because I didn't really have any job training. I was, you know, a hustler for my whole life. What can I do to make money? So I didn't, yeah, I punched a clock briefly here and there, but I didn't have much to hang my hat on.

Finding Vintage Fabric Hidden Value

SPEAKER_01 6:13

Gotcha. I totally understand that. Now, you've built a pretty successful business in a very specific specific niche. So vintage fabrics and collectibles, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:23

That came later, yep.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

Okay. So how did you discover that niche? And what made you realize that there was actually a market for it?

SPEAKER_00 6:32

It was another one of those things that was cheap. I'm still in the cheap lane. I mean, it's been 18 years since I got divorced. And granted, I can afford to buy bigger ticket items now when I know that there's a nice profit to be made. I can spend more at an auction, but I still live in the nickel and dime stuff every chance I get because that's when it's the most fun. So fabric was something that nobody wanted at the end of an auction. It was something that there was very little competition for. I see these boxes full of fabric from a quilter who had passed away. I'm like, there's gotta be value in that, right? But I didn't know anything about fabric either. I I knew nothing. So I just bought some of it, came home, played with it, researched other people, you know, stalked some other people, tried to figure out what do I have here. Um, and it's not something, it's not something that genuinely and doesn't generally bring the big ticket like the eBay items that I buy in style. But just yesterday I had somebody place an order for, I don't know, almost $300. And and that's not uncommon. It's more work than just packaging one thing that I sold on eBay, but it's the community of Etsy that I fell in love with. So I kinda I can't give up eBay because it's pays for the stuff I still on Etsy. Um, but yeah, it just it ended up being two businesses, and and I I loved one more than the other, but I couldn't give up the original one that I started. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 8:01

Now, getting into eBay, how did you learn what to start looking for at these auctions?

SPEAKER_00 8:09

I I didn't have a clue. Um, I couldn't in in my books I call them the big bucks, and they are the people that show up to the sale uh with their boxes and they get a front row seat and they go around and you know they will sit in the tent for all the things that the auctioneer sells first, all the things that the auctioneer put in the ad, all the things that the auctioneer thinks is gonna bring the most money, and they will sit in their chairs and they will bid pretty decent money. And then when those tent items are gone, they go home. So I don't I didn't compete with them in the beginning. I couldn't. I couldn't afford to, and I didn't know what I was buying. You know, I couldn't afford to spend 50 bucks on something I didn't even know what it was. It it wasn't like it is today where I could snap a picture of it and the internet's gonna tell me what it is, what it's worth, whatever. We didn't have that technology. I couldn't even look anything up when I was at an auction. I just had to go with a gut, and the only thing I could do was buy stuff that I could afford and take a chance. So I had no idea what I was looking for. Um, but back then people liked to bid on things. Now they just want to buy it now, get it over with. I want it in my mailbox tomorrow. You know, it's an Amazon culture. But back then it was exciting. People like to bid against each other, and so I could list it for a couple dollars what I paid for it and see what happened. And so little by little I learned, oh wow, that was worth money. So then I'd start looking for that again. Um, but you know, cultures change on eBay and things that were worth something. I mean, Beanie Babies is what started eBay, and it's not they're not worth anything now. So as as I've gone along in this business, I've had to watch the trends and I've had to keep up on things to see if it is that still worth money. Oh, it's not? Oh, okay. But I still live in the weird lane, I still discover things every single day that somebody wants, and I'm amazed.

SPEAKER_01 9:58

That's awesome.

Standing Out With Stories On Etsy

SPEAKER_01 10:00

How did you figure out what made your business different from all the other resellers out there?

SPEAKER_00 10:06

I don't think I really started to feel different until I had an Etsy shop. eBay, I was just it was day-to-day trying to pay the bills and and being hopeful. I was, you know, buying and selling and listing as fast as I possibly could. Um, you know, I I didn't watch TV for for four years because I didn't I didn't have time. All of my effort and energy had to be put into making money and that meant really hitting it hard. So when I started on the Etsy shop, when I opened the Etsy shop, um I was coasting a little bit at that point. I had uh remarried, and while we both brought quite a bit of debt to the table, we both were also ordinary average working people, and two incomes is always better than one. So I was able to quit my job at the school and just focus on resale. And I opened up my Etsy shop and I had a little bit more time to dedicate to growing my audience. I started to tell stories on my Etsy pages. I started to talk about where it had come from, I started to talk about uh the competition, the auctioneer, I started to make it more personal. And you in this this and this was years ago. So in this world of AI that we're facing right now, it's very welcoming. I think that I could have built an audience now just being personal versus versus the AI. But it was something that happened a little bit over time since we didn't have this AI garbage back then. Um, but yeah, it just drew people to the shop. They appreciated knowing more about what they were buying, they appreciated having the history, they appreciated the human connection, and so my customer base and my repeat sales grew pretty fast.

SPEAKER_01 11:50

Wow, all through storytelling.

SPEAKER_00 11:52

All through storytelling. And I had a unique offering. I wasn't the only one selling vintage fabric, but I was also selling antique style or antique textiles that maybe to somebody looks like they should be in the trash, but those textiles cut apart like old quilts with flaws or you know, old wool blankets with holes. There's so many ways to repurpose old textiles. And so I started attracting a community of people that were into the recycling and the upcycling and you know making something new from something old. And it just really, really evolved. I have a pretty unique offering, and and Etsy has so many sellers, it's ridiculous. So standing out takes effort.

SPEAKER_01 12:33

Yeah, I would imagine it does.

Books Speaking And Free Promotion

SPEAKER_01 12:35

Now, this business trend, like your business in general, eventually led you to write books and become a public speaker. Now, you've already talked about storytelling on Etsy. How did you go from selling the vintage items online to realizing that, hey, you actually have stories that people would actually want to read and you could put them into a book?

SPEAKER_00 12:56

And that was really accidental, also. At the core of me, I've always been a writer. I that was the only thing I ever thought I was gonna do. I'm gonna write. Um, and that's part of the reason why I didn't pursue a higher education, why I didn't pursue some sort of job training, because it was like, dang it, I am gonna write. And and I tried. I wrote four novels in my 20s and in my only early 30s. Uh I had an agent, uh, I had some reads from great publishers, but I never got anything published. So I finally sold something in in my 30s. I sold a magazine article, but in my 40s, I had to put it away. I you you can't do something that doesn't pay you money. So I think that after having put it away for so long, I think it just started to come out. I think it's like, you know, I've I always feel like there's something I need to say, and certainly somebody out there is interested in what I have to say. Um, so yeah, when my customers started to request, hey, you really need to write a book. You need to write these full length stories and put them in a book. And initially I'm like, okay, when? When am I gonna find the time to do that? You know? Um, but after a few years, I finally gave in. I'm like, all right, I'm gonna do it. Let's do it. And so the public speaking came about because after I published my book, I'm like, okay, well, it's kind of a really niche market, and it's not just about fabric, the books. Yes, it's about hunting the fabric, but it's also about the other things that I buy and sell. And oh, I thought there was gonna be fabric, but there was nothing, and this is what I found instead. You know, it's kind of a life journey, it's it's a memoir, it's a lot of things. Um, but I had to market it. So I was like, okay, well, who might be interested in this very niche book? Okay, well, quilters were probably interested, and we have quilting guilds in in all over. So I started to email quilting guilds to be one of their guest speakers. And yeah, I started out not charging, just invite me and I'll prove myself, and I would sell books. Now I earn a speaking fee, I earn mileage, and I sell books. You know, it's probably the single place that I sell the most books.

SPEAKER_01 15:02

So it sounds like the big thing was you just put yourself out there.

SPEAKER_00 15:07

Yeah. And any way I could think to do it, that was cheap or free.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

Yeah, and and how scary was that for you at the time?

SPEAKER_00 15:16

I have been terrified of public speaking my entire life. I've been terrified of making a fool of myself in front of people my entire life. Um, I think the first quilting guild I I went to, I mean, I was sweating and my mouth was dry, and you know, I was I was an absolute wreck. You know, because you're a afraid of I don't know, you get afraid of imposter syndrome among all things. I mean, that is huge. I didn't know anything about fabric, and I'm talking to a hundred people who have been working with fabric their entire lives, you know. It's like, how how do I know I'm know what I'm talking about? So it was very, very terrifying, 100%. Absolutely. Uh, but the more shows that I did and the more credibility I received and the more books that I sold and the more feedback I got, and it's just it was a huge, a huge confidence boost, you know, and and I got into I got into podcasting as another way uh to to push forward and to um promote. But the first podcast happened by accident too. You know, another way that I did free advertising, I had I had written the book, they had asked me to write the book. So, of course, what am I gonna do? I'm gonna put notes in all of my outgoing packages. Hey, I I wrote the book, here it is, find it here, find it there, whatever. Just this little note, and I'd handwrite thank you, whatever on it. And six weeks after I started to do that, I got an email from a TV producer. She was a customer. And next thing I know, she's signing me a contract for reality TV. Yeah, I mean, completely again random, and it was from a note that took me two seconds to put inside of a package. You know, you just put yourself out there and you never know. But my first podcast host found me right around the same time, just scrolling through ebooks on Amazon. She was she's a knitter, she works in a different textile, but she was interested in talking to me. But it's just, yeah, it it it's kind of bizarre that when you really put yourself out there and allow yourself to be vulnerable, that there are so many creative ways and inexpensive ways to announce to the world, yeah, here I am. I think I know what I'm doing. You know, hire me.

SPEAKER_01 17:30

I love that because so many people think you have to run ads to be successful.

SPEAKER_00 17:34

You don't. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 17:37

And you're proof of that. You're proof of that. And I think too, I don't know how many times you said it happened on accident on here. But I think those opportunities are all around us all the time. We just have to open our eyes to them and be receptive to them.

SPEAKER_00 17:52

Absolutely, and be and be vulnerable and allow yourself to hiccup and to fail and to learn from it. And that's really hard to do, especially oh yeah, it's really hard to do.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

I always say that I think business is just a series of failures one after another until one hits, and then you're you you're gold.

SPEAKER_00 18:13

Yeah, and and that's kind of what happened with Etsy. I mean, yes, I sort of have a following on eBay, but I mean I've sold gosh more than 70,000 things in the last 20 years between the two, between the two stores. But I would say that most of the people on eBay don't know me from Adam. I'm just another seller. But on Etsy, you know, we chat, we go back and forth. You know, it's like I've developed this, it's just it just took off. It I don't know. I mean, I developed a product that removes odors from textiles. I've got that in the cache. You know, there's just all these things that have happened since I opened that shop.

SPEAKER_01 18:48

Oh, that's awesome.

Debt-Free Mindset And Simple Sacrifices

SPEAKER_01 18:50

Now, you talked about when you remarried, you guys both brought debt into the relationship.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

And you've talked about spending years dealing with financial stress before eventually becoming debt-free. How did running your own business change your relationship with money?

SPEAKER_00 19:07

Uh, one thing I know about myself that I've learned about myself is that the broker I was, for some reason, the more I wanted to spend money. It just was like, oh, well, screw it. I'm I'm broke, I can't pay the bills anyway, I might as well buy it. I might as well have it. It'll make me happy. And it it never does. I mean, the retail therapy is fun for a minute, you know. But when I'm making money and I'm not behind on bills, and and there's extra money, it it's addictive to save it too. I never thought it would be a thing. Uh you know, I've I've got money I could spend right now, but I don't have a clue what I'd buy. You know, it's just it's just a different relationship. Um we became debt-free uh three years ago at 55. We own our house. We we we have a five-acre farm, we own that, we own our vehicles, we own everything. It it's it's incredible. And I don't know what that that's like. But my car is also 11 years old. But I serviced it, I keep it on the road. I don't care about a new car. I would much rather not have that big, fat, huge car payment every month. You know, you gotta pick what you want in life.

SPEAKER_01 20:15

Oh, I'm with you on that. My car's a nine years old, but it is paid for. Yeah. My house. My house is not paid for, but I do have a good chunk of equity in it. Yeah, it's on the list of things. It's the last thing I I have debt on. Yeah. It it really is. It really is.

Advice For Women Rebuilding Alone

SPEAKER_01 20:37

Now, I want you to imagine that there's a woman listening to this right now who's 45, 55, and she's just gone through a divorce or lost her job, or maybe she's experienced something that has completely changed her life and upended everything. She needs money, she's overwhelmed, and she has no idea where to start. What would you tell her? What advice would you give to that woman?

SPEAKER_00 20:59

Draw on, you know, everybody I think has an ounce of creativity. So I think some are blessed with more, some are blessed with less. But it you have to outline your priorities. What does my ideal day look like? What am I willing to sacrifice on? And what am I not willing to sacrifice on? You know, I had a 14-year-old daughter to raise. I wasn't willing to go get a job that made her come home from school by herself every day. So that was a non-negotiable. It's like, okay, I have to figure out a way to work around this. And sometimes you have to swallow your pride and do things that you really don't want to do either. Um, I have climbed through some nasty, dirty spaces to pull out things that I have bought and sold. You know, and it you just yeah, sometimes you just gotta buckle up and do it. Uh, you know, pull on your big girl pants, whatever that means. I I worked on the playground blowing a whistle to supplement the side job. I I hate winter, I hate the cold. I did nothing But complain every single day during the wintertime. You know, my friend who worked on the playground with me, she'd come out and she'd have, you know, no hat on and a perfect do, and I would come out and I would be bundled to the hill. You could all you could see were my eyes, and all I'd do is complain about how cold I was. And she'd be like, Tough it up! I'm like, I'm so cold. You know. But it took it took 15 years from the time that I got divorced to to become debt-free. Um but I geez, I quit side gigs after only four years, and and it just it just was this one thing. You know, you just you have to be willing to sacrifice, you have to be willing to suffer for a little while for the the ultimate goal. Put something on your calendar. I want to be here at this point and just work towards it. And yeah, try to stay out of debt.

SPEAKER_01 22:51

Yes, yes. I I hear you on that. I grew up in a in a family that just debt was the norm. And and that's how I ended up. And I had to work really hard to get out of it.

SPEAKER_00 23:03

So it's much easier to get in debt than it is to get out of it. So if you can limit the debt you accrue, you'll be better off in the end. And I understand it's necessary when you don't have any other choice. Um, but yeah, the more debt that you have, the harder it is to pay your bills every month. 100%.

SPEAKER_01 23:21

And I know that there's someone out there listening to this right now who really, really needs to hear that. And hear that there is hope. There is hope. That it is possible.

SPEAKER_00 23:30

It is hope. And and you know, and if if somebody is in debt, and this is something I learned too, there were times when I had seven, eight, nine sources of debt. And I would look at it and be like, oh God, how am I ever going to get out from underneath this? And and I would try to throw money here and throw money there, and what I learned best was to take the lowest balance that you have and pound it until it's gone, and then go to the next one. But in the meantime, don't add. Don't be added anymore. But just start small and have these little baby steps, these goals. But ticking off those those debts one at a time, all of a sudden you start to add more money and more money and more money. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:11

Absolutely. That's the same way I did it. I got one of those little ones off, and then I took what I was paying on it and added it to the next one. And it really does work.

SPEAKER_00 24:20

It does work, but you have to stay dedicated. And you yeah. And and that doesn't mean don't treat yourself. We all need something. You know, um, I'm very guilty of my online purchase once a month of whatever. I have my favorite stores, I still love clearance tracks. So you have to have something. Allow yourself to have something once a month, whatever, whether it be go to the movies, go out to eat, buy new apps that, you know, because there's retail therapy is real in that department. It it boosts your spirits, it makes you feel like you're actually getting something out of life, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 24:51

I agree. And I feel like, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, because I've I've never been married, but I can still relate to this from other aspects of my life. As women, we tend to give all we have to everybody else. And we forget to take anything for ourselves, especially once you hit your 40s and up. And and like you said, it's so important to do something for yourself, even if it's just go out and treat yourself to a coffee.

SPEAKER_00 25:23

Yeah, something. Something. And that goes for time too. Um, you know, I hit it hard for so many years trying, trying to grow, trying to pay bills, trying to do this. I was on this hamster wheel of nonstop stress. And now that now that I'm not, I realize how important it is the 10 or 15 minutes that I take every day being outside, going outside, feeding the animals, doing something centering. It's it's it's incredibly huge. So everybody can afford 10 or 15 minutes out of the day, whether it be take a walk, whether it be read a devotional, whether it be close your eyes, something to give yourself a level of, you know.

SPEAKER_01 26:06

Yeah, and you bring up a good point. It doesn't even have to involve money. It doesn't even have to involve money.

Where To Find Kira Online

SPEAKER_01 26:12

I love that. Now, Kira, if someone wants to learn more about you, find the book, where can they find you?

SPEAKER_00 26:19

Fabric Wars and Fabric Wars and more. Um, they're on Amazon. You can also find them in my Etsy shop. My Etsy shop is dot audity. Uh, if you're a textile person or craft person, hit me up on.auddity and we will talk for hours. You know, I have I have a great inventory, I have great stories, I have great ideas, and everybody that I've talked to, you know, yeah, I love sharing things with people in that regard. Um, Instagram is also under.audity, and I post things for the shop a lot of times there, specials I'm having, or something I found, or I I'm a huge flower addict. I have more flower gardens than I have time to weed them, so you'll probably see flowers popping up here and there. Um yeah, Facebook, Kira Hartley Klinger, I have an author page there, LinkedIn, same thing. But I'm not hugely active on social media because who has the time? But Instagram is great for advertising, which on that note you do not have to pay to boost any advertising on social media either. It's a huge waste of money. So be creative.

SPEAKER_01 27:26

Absolutely. I agree 100%. Well, thank you so much for coming on the show. And like Kira said, sometimes you just have to get out there and put in the work, but know that it will pay off in the long run. And until next time, keep planning like a boss.