SPEAKER_00: 0:26

Welcome back to Plan Like a Boss. Today I'm here with Kimberly Roy from Pitch With Kim. And she helps entrepreneurs and authors with podcasting and media visibility strategies to grow their business through authentic storytelling and relationship marketing. And I am so excited to talk to her today about podcast pitching.

SPEAKER_01: 0:47

So welcome, Kimberly. Thank you so much, Tanya. Tell me, start by telling me about yourself. Like, how did you get into podcast pitching?

SPEAKER_02: 0:56

Oh my gosh. Well, isn't that a story? I always say that my story and how I got into this is definitely one of evolution. So I actually have a corporate background. I left behind a 20-year career in compliance banking. So a lot of people are like, how in the world did you go from the banking industry to this, right? And that is why I say it's one of evolution. So at a pivotal time in my life where I really needed an outlet to help me heal from a trauma that I had uh endured, I went to I went to podcasting. I don't know what struck my fancy about it, Tanya, but there was something about the podcasting space that really intrigued me. And I used it just as a creative outlet. And it ended up transforming into something so beautiful. Um, and fast forward a couple of years later, the universe basically was like, all right, time to, time to make a move. Um, I lost my job unexpectedly, and one thing led to another. And next thing I know, I find myself in this space empowering women to use their voice just like what I needed to do at a tr at the time that I needed most of my life. So it is definitely very personally um related to just my story, but definitely one that um lends itself to where I am today.

SPEAKER_01: 2:15

I love that. That is so inspiring because so many people believe that entrepreneurs start early like I did. I started when I was still in college. But that's not true. There are so many successful entrepreneurs out there who this is like their second career, their second stage of life, and they find it so much more fulfilling.

SPEAKER_02: 2:33

It really is. It really is. I say now, I'm more alive now than I ever was before. But had you asked me even just three years ago, if I could see myself doing this, I'd be like, you're you're kidding me, right? You're crazy. There's no way I could have possibly have seen it. But I love what you said there because you know, we always start so early in life thinking that we have to have it all figured out. And having gone through what I've gone through, I now realize that no, actually, we're not necessarily meant for one thing ever. It's just like another chapter in our story, in our book, right?

SPEAKER_01: 3:05

Absolutely. I love that. So tell me, the majority of my audience are entrepreneurs and solopreneurs. Why should entrepreneurs and solopreneurs be pitching podcasts?

SPEAKER_02: 3:16

Oh my gosh, why? Why shouldn't they? Is the better question, right? Uh, there are so many benefits to getting onto podcasts, but essentially, it is it at the root of what it is, it is a consistent source of lead generation, is an amazing lead generation strategy for your marketing, your PR. Um, but even more than that, it's really building your authority and your thought leadership. It is building that brand identity, that voice identity in your business. So ultimately, there's so many reasons why you should be guessing and pitching yourself to be a guest onto podcast, right? So I ask you, Tanya, where would you like me to start? What do you think your audience needs to hear? Because there are studies, there are stats that back it up, right? And I can talk about the marketing aspect of it, but I could then I can also talk about ultimately what it can do for your business and where you want to take your business.

SPEAKER_01: 4:19

I let's skip the stats and let's go straight to what's in it for me, because I know that's what my audience is asking.

SPEAKER_02: 4:26

Yeah, what's in it for you? So, what do you need when you're building a business, right? And you're looking to turn a revenue and you're looking to create an impact, you need to build that trust with your ideal client, building that relationship. And you do that through, quite honestly, it's being human. So when I talk about pitching, I say this is not, yes, there's an ask behind this, but it's not about being sleazy, it's not about being salesy, it's about being human at the end of the day. You're making a connection with somebody, right? And that is what that's at the core of business. You're building trust with people that you invite into your world, your ideal clients, people that you want to impart impact on, that you want to impart your wisdom on, that you want to have some kind of help them with some kind of a transformation, right? So you need that trust. What happens when you get on a podcast, when you strategically align yourself with the right podcast to be on? So when I say that, there's there's intent behind it, you know, the focus on the type of podcast you get on is very intentional. When you get onto the right podcast and you know you're speaking to your ideal audience, that's like standing in a room full of people there for you to hear you, right? Your ideal clients. Think of like a conference room. So your trust is accelerated. You are establishing authority in someone else's community, so you're leveraging their audience, right? So when you think of a client journey and a journey that they need to go through, your ideal client, you're hitting cold, warm, and hot, right? Cold is that visibility, that's where that visibility lies. That's where you want to get in front of. You want to get in front of people who don't know you exist yet. And podcasting is that space to do that. I love that.

SPEAKER_01: 6:11

Yeah, yeah. I love that. So, how should someone decide which podcast to pitch to? Because I know that's a big thing. There are thousands or probably millions of podcasts out there. How do they decide which ones they should be pitching to?

SPEAKER_02: 6:29

Yeah, and that's such a great question. And that is one of the questions I get asked all the time is where and how and how do I find these, right? So when you are starting on your pitching journey, well, whether you're starting, maybe you've never guessed it before, or you're this is something new you're embarking, or maybe you've done it before. I always say that you want to make sure your foundation is strong and your foundation is something that you're going to revisit over and over. What is that, right? That's looking at your niche. Who is it that you serve? Who is that person? And what is it that you help them that you help them with? What is that transformation you help them achieve? What is it on the other side of it? When you have that foundation, you align your podcast appearances and your opportunities with that. You want to make sure that the podcast serves a similar audience as your ideal client? Is your ideal audience a listener on the other side of that? So you look at what are their values? What is the podcast's mission and objective and who do they serve? Um, what is the ultimate goal or the objective of that podcast? Does that resonate with you? Right. And does that resonate with the similar audience that you serve as well? So I always say look at things from a collaborative perspective and not only from um a dead-on angle. So let me just give you an example, right? Maybe you have a nutrition coach who is looking to get onto some podcasts. Well, yes, ultimately they ideally would want to look at some nutrition-related podcasts, right? But also looking at things from a collaborative perspective of where else is that nutrition's audience and ideal client hanging out? If they're into wellness, they might be listening to some fitness podcasts. Maybe they're also into holistic wellness and they might also be listening to some podcasts about meditation, breath work, right? So you start looking at things of where does my ideal client hang out? That's why having an understanding of her foundation is so important because then you can really tune into what I call their psychological factors. Who is that person? Where do they hang out, right? And apply that to the digital world. What podcast are they listening to? Where do they hang out? So that's where you want to start finding where.

SPEAKER_01: 8:44

Excellent, excellent. And do you have a process that you go through when you're researching a podcast before pitching?

SPEAKER_02: 8:52

100%. Yes, yes. When I when I do pitching for my client inside of a done for you pitching, the strategy is where we start. The strategy is where I that foundation I was talking about, we really do a deep dive in that. Because the other component of that too is understanding what is the value you're bringing to that audience, right? So that's another way to think of your research too. What's the value I'm bringing, aka your signature topic? Because essentially, when you're getting on a podcast, that is a form of content. Just like a blog or your content on social media, podcasting is another long form content. And your topic that you're bringing on that podcast is super important. So having an understanding of what is that, that's the value you're gonna bring, right? So we really, we really touch on that. So that's part of that strategy. And then when I start looking at podcasts, I apply everything I was just talking about, but there's also a vetting vetting criteria that I look at. So the things that you want to really look at uh before you even send a pitch their way. First of all, is the podcast active? And what is the definition of active, right? The industry standard will tell you 60 to 90 days. So basically at least one episode published within the last quarter. For me personally, that's outside of my comfort zone when I pitch for my clients. I'm looking at like, I want to see at least 30 of something published within the last 30 days. So I say safe like 30 to 60 days, right? Are they active? That's the first question you want to ask yourself. The second question is do they accept guests? Take a look, take a look through, get to know the podcast that you're planning on pitching. Um, that's also being gen genuine and it's really ethical, right? To do that. Get to know who you want to build a collaboration with and understand are they even accepting guests and what types of guests do they have on here? That's another way to find is there alignment? So that's the that's the other criteria that you want to look at. And then ultimately aligning with well, does my ideal client live here? Is there alignment? Does my topic, is my topic going to add value to this audience?

SPEAKER_01: 10:55

Excellent. Those are great, great tips. Now, when it comes to the actual pitching process, what makes a pitch stand out? Because I'm sure these podcasts get hundreds of pitches a week, if not more. So, what can what can people do to help their pitch stand out?

SPEAKER_02: 11:15

Yes, yes. And that that is so they they do, they get hundreds of pitches. Um, and so they're looking for what is what stands out from the crowd. So the biggest thing I started this conversation at the beginning saying, what is a pitch? It's being human, right? Yes, it's an ask. You are reaching out with an ask. And so there's a ton of different ways that I can dive into on like how do you position yourself on the pitch? How do you, you know, cre you know, create, make it a captivating, right? Attention grabbing, essentially. Um, and how do you position yourself? Those are the always the questions I get. So, yes, there's a component to that, but at the end of the day, at the root of that pitch, it's being human. So you're looking to build a connection with that host. So the first thing you want to do is definitely personalize that pitch. That is like the biggest thing. Like I said, when you're doing research or doing your homework, really build a connection with that host. Um, the other thing, too, in a world of AI and automation that we're in today, 100%. I'm not saying not to leverage a little chat GPT to help you, right? 100%. I use it in my business all the time. But be smart about it. Make it your own. Go back to making it human, okay? Because all the pitches that these hosts are getting, they're getting a lot of that. They're getting a lot of copy paste and it's feeling very AI-ish, right? It's just not feeling organic. It's feeling a little disingenuous. So position yourself to stand out from that, make it your own, be creative. I've actually personally started playing around with even for my clients that I'm pitching for, right? Sending a little um video along with the pitch, really trying to stand out from the crowd and getting creative with it. The other thing that goes a long, long way, and people don't do enough of this, is engagement. Engagement. It goes back to building relationships with these people. I'm not saying to be disingenuous about it, but show interest, follow them on their social media, engage with their content, maybe get on their email list and support them, right? Build some engagement, be human along the way. It's not just about the pitch, it's what you do leading up to it, and it's what you do after the pitch as well. That goes that it's it's the whole um the whole process of it. I call it the art of pitching. It's a it's a very much a workflow about it.

SPEAKER_01: 13:35

I love it. You you've got a novel right there. You're the next bestseller. You've got a book happening. Okay, so now what are some of the most common mistakes you see when it comes to pitching? I know you mentioned Chat GPT. Is there anything else that you see kind of on a regular basis where a client comes to you and says, this is what I've been doing, and you're like, ugh, red flag right there?

SPEAKER_02: 13:57

Yeah, well, I mean, gosh. Okay, so I think the biggest things I hear is I've done this, but it's not working, right? Podcast guesting, while there are a number of benefits to doing it, like I mentioned at the beginning, there is also an art to doing it, and to do it so that the ROI that you're looking to receive from it, you're gonna get it. And that you need to be a contributor to that, right? So I would say that the biggest mistake, number one, is going back to what I just finished saying is the engagement. You want to make sure you're doing that. You want to make sure you're doing that. That is so hugely important to the relationship that you're building so that the pitch is not cold. You have to warm up that pitch, essentially, right? So doing the engagement. The other thing that I that I see a lot of people doing is really shooting for the stars before they've started. And what I mean by that is we all have goals to get on those very large, high-profile podcasts. But if we don't have experience interviewing and if we don't have a publicity portfolio already built out, we have to start from somewhere. So give yourself grace to climb the ladder and to get there. Um, the other thing, which is very much connected to the engagement, is having connections and who you know can get you closer to those goals too, right? So the engagement allows you to build the connections that you need to get yourself closer to that. So it all really lends itself quite well. Um, and then inside of the pitch, too, the big I I would say, you know, less about you, more about them. What's in it for them? Again, it's that value exchange. You're asking for something. So what are you going to give in return? And be genuine about it. But it's less of it's less about you and more about them. What's that value you're gonna bring? And show that you've done your homework, right? Show why you believe that you can bring value to that audience.

SPEAKER_01: 15:56

I love that. I love that. Now, to go back, we mentioned before that these podcasts get hundreds, if not thousands, of pitches on a regular basis. So we know that you're not guaranteed and you're gonna get a lot of no's. So, what is your advice in handling rejection and keeping persistent in pitching?

SPEAKER_02: 16:19

Oh, yes, the persistent. I like that word. Um, I like that word actually, because I always say consistency is key. And the thing about consistency is it's we often misinterpret consistency for frequency. We think, oh, consistent means daily, right? And it's that's not necessarily what it means. It's always about define a frequency that feels good and attainable for you, and then make that your consistent, right? So to re to echo what you said, to maintain your persistence, right? That is so important, also to the ROI that you want to get. And yes, along the way, you're going to get ghosted, you're going to get no's. You may even get a yes and then get ghosted. I've seen it all, okay. The bottom line is please don't take it personal. It is never about you. And it truly goes back to human nature. Think of yourself as an example. Think of what your inbox looks like. Think of the number of emails you're getting. If you're a podcast host yourself, you're probably also getting a number of, you know, pitches in your inbox. Things happen. People go through things where next thing, you know, an emergency, maybe they have to pause their podcast unexpectedly. Maybe they are going on maternity leave, maybe they're going on vacation, maybe you never know what is going on on the back end. You absolutely cannot take it personal. The best that you can do is keep with that persistence, stay consistent with your outreach. Make sure that you're following up on those pitches because 60% of yeses come from those pitches. So please don't send an email and then a week later, oh my gosh, they haven't heard back. Two weeks later, I haven't heard back. They don't, they don't like me. If you didn't follow up, your email might still be sitting there and they might not even be aware of it, right? So I and you know, there's so much more to that, Tanya. There's so much more to that. But essentially, there you have it.

SPEAKER_01: 18:20

I yeah, I love that. I love that. And I, you know, I pitch podcasts, I've been on a number of podcasts, and I consistently pitch 10 every month. I've pitched hundreds of podcasts, and I have a 10 to 20% response rate from them of the ones I actually book. And I do, I do have to say, I do get ghosted a lot, but the the no's that I get are always the sweetest and most polite no's. And a lot of them are not yet. It might be, you know, we're booked out for the year, but we'll keep you in mind. And that's when I make a little note and I make a note to follow up with them next year. And and I even send a reply, you know, thank you so much. I'll I'll I'll follow up with you next year and see if there's room on your schedule. And I I think that is really beneficial. And I've booked some because of that follow-up.

SPEAKER_02: 20:17

Yes, I appreciate you saying that so much because I get that a lot too. A no is always a not yet. It's always a not, even if they say no and they don't actually provide a reason, um, it's always a not yet. It's just an opportunity to to revisit that again in the future. The fact that you even got a reply back is key because now you've you've there's there, first of all, in the email worlds, which you're the expert, Tanya, but now there's there's that connection there. The email's been opened, they've it's been responded to, right? Um, so and that so there's that aspect, you have some kind of an element of connection already built with them. And then this is where that engagement comes in, right? When you get a know or anything, keep engaging with them, stay in their world, show that you're interested and that this is not just another PR play, right? I think that that's the biggest thing. Um, and to your point, Tanya, always respond back. Thank you, thank you so much for getting back to me. I pre good luck. I'm wishing you the best with your show. I will reach back out next year to see if there's another opportunity. You know, it's like it goes back to being human. Be human.

SPEAKER_01: 21:20

Absolutely, absolutely. And um I guess so. Now you've you've pitched the podcast and you've booked the podcast and you're you're you've guessed it on it. It's recorded. What post-interview practices do you recommend to maximize the the impact of a podcast appearance?

SPEAKER_02: 21:40

Yeah, and I love this. And I we you and you and I were having a similar conversation just the other day. So I will absolutely invite you to join me on this conversation because you are the SEO expert. Um, but what I will say is yes, to maximize that episode, first of all, you want to make sure you're sharing it, right? So I've had actually some clients say to me, um, I just don't have time. And I'm like, well, you're losing opportunity there, right? You need to have some kind of a way to share it back with your own audience because it's it's the reciprocation, it's the abundance of it, right? So you're leveraging the podcast's audience, yes. And quite honestly, they're also in a way leveraging yours. So there's a give and take. But if you're not sharing it with your audience, you're not showcasing your own authority and thought leadership either. And your audience, this is still an audience that you're building that trust with. These are the people that sitting that in that inside of that warm, right? I was saying the cold, warm, hot. They're sitting inside the warm. They're on your email list, they're in your social media. Share those podcast episodes, okay? If the podcast host does not provide assets, I still encourage you to share it some kind of a way. You could create your own template if that feels good to you. Um, but certainly it is also your responsibility to have a conversation with the host and ask for what you would like. Maybe they're not aware that they, you know, that people are interested in assets. And it doesn't even have to be marketing assets that they take time to create. It might could simply be just the link to the episode, right? So asking for what you need and then making it easy for them by providing them with your own template of things that you would like included in their in the show notes for the episode or anything that you know they can share with their audience, right? Like a headshot of yours, your social media links, any freebie links, your lead magnets, that kind of a thing. Um, and Tanya, I want you to join in on this from an SEO perspective because you're the expert in that space. And so please, please, please, please join in and share how people can really leverage SEO um as a podcast guest.

SPEAKER_01: 23:45

Absolutely. We we were literally just having this conversation last week because you had a client who had some SEO questions. And from an SEO perspective, podcasts are the number one way to get backlinks these days. And backlinks help you build authority with Google. Um so, from an SEO perspective, as far as your website is concerned, you know, send that file over to them with your headshot, have your bio, and then have the links. Have a link to whatever you're promoting at the time, have a link to your freebie, have a link to your website. This is gonna send what I call link juice back to your website from this podcast, and it's gonna signal to Google that you're an authority, but it goes beyond that. So sharing on social media, absolutely, and what I know what I do, this is my personal practice, and you're definitely the podcast expert. But when I am interviewing with someone, at the end of the podcast, I ask them, Hey, do you have any idea when this is coming out? And a lot of times they have an exact date they can tell you. And in the past, they've looked at the calendar before and said, you know, it's it's gonna come out this date. Will that work for you? And I'm I'm like, you know, that would be great. I'm actually launching something the week before, and they're like, Hold on. And they're like, I just switched you with somebody else, it's gonna come out that day instead. Um, also I asked them to send me over a link. And I I just I'm very clear, hey, will you send me a link when it comes out or tag me so that I can share it with my audience? I would love them to be able to hear this. Well, that's just gonna make the podcast host so happy because they're gonna get more listens out of it, and that is gonna help boost their podcast. It is also gonna, as you said, help you build topical authority. Send it in your email, send it in your uh your send it in your email, put it on your Instagram, your TikTok, whatever, Facebook, whatever you use. I think most of us use Instagram right now for business. And then also go ahead and put it on your website with a link to it. Um, have a list of podcasts on your website and um hot kettle black, etc. I was telling you, I've got to do this. This is something that I still haven't done. So do as I say, not as I do, and put it on your website as well. But that's gonna help get help you get exposure. And then if they don't get back to you, I've got it on my calendar the date it's supposed to come out. I will actually go and find it. I will screenshot their um graphic for the episode and I'll share it in my stories, and I'll put you know, put something on. I had so much fun chatting with this person. I will tag them in it, and I will go ahead and link to the episode just by tagging them. It's gonna get me exposed a little more to their audience online on Instagram, and every single time I've done this, they've shared it to their stories.

SPEAKER_02: 27:10

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, to all that. Yes, yes, yes. Uh, I love that. Thank you. And I love that you're bringing in an SEO expertise, you know, your expertism in that area. Is that even a word? Your expertise, thank you, in that word, uh, in that area, and then also as a guest yourself, too, and like what your practice is. What your practice is, is what ideally what I, you know, encouraged all of my clients to do. This is amazing. I love that. Um, something I want to add to that is, you know, like you said, in the event they don't send you whatever, or they don't remind you, whatever, because it is still your responsibility as the guests, it is your responsibility ultimately, not the host's responsibility. Again, it goes back to they have their own workflow, their own processes. Things might happen. They might have, you know, some team fluctuations on the back end, they might have whatever they had an emergency, so they have their podcast manager publishing the episodes, but the, you know, the emails aren't getting anything could happen, right? And so it's still your responsibility as the guest to be on the lookout for that and to take at the action that aligns best with getting the ROI that you want to get from it. Um, and so just knowing too that that, yeah, you play a role in that success just as much as the publication of that episode.

SPEAKER_01: 28:34

Yes. And a way to think about it is what you focus on, you create more of. And if you're focusing on visibility, you're going to create that visibility for yourself. And I think that's a good way to think about it. Now, to tie back, you mentioned earlier people saying they don't have time. They don't have time. And uh my simple solution to that is pay somebody else to do it. Um, now I will say I understand not everybody has that capability, but I would seriously look at your books and say, can I afford somebody to just go follow up on this engagement? Can I afford somebody to do this? Every time that I have outsourced things in my life, I have never felt ready to do it. But it has helped my business grow so much. And it's just a business mindset you've got to switch over to. You've got to outsource if you're gonna grow. Otherwise, you're gonna stay small. If you do it all yourself, you're gonna stay smaller. Now, with that said, there are probably a lot of people out there listening to this right now going, I would love to be pitching to this podcast, these podcasts. I would love to grow my visibility, but I'm a one-person show. I just don't have time to do it. And I know that you offer done for you podcast pitching services. So if if someone out there is like, I need somebody to do this for me, how can they get in touch with you?

SPEAKER_02: 29:56

Yes, yes. So pitch with Kim everywhere, first and foremost, right? So my website is pitchwithkim.com, my email is Kim at pitchwithkim.com, and Instagram is also pitch with Kim. So very, very easy to find me any any any way, right? Any way that's easy that feels good to you, you can reach out to me that way. But yes, my done for you framework is my signature framework. And it is, it is a full service, um, full service framework um where I do it all. We start, like I said, we start with a strategy session to really do that deep dive. So I have an understanding of the foundation. I have an understanding of your value that we're you're gonna bring. Um, and I and I also that's that's really what I what my I'm gifted in, truly, right? Is my perceptiveness and my intuitive gift there where I help you and I pull a lot of that out with you. Um so it's very much a co-creation. It's a lot of fun, there's a lot of magic that unfolds there. And then from an administrative perspective, I take care of everything. I do the matchmaking with the aligned um podcasts that are the right fit, and all of the actual functionality on in the pitching workflow that we talked about today, right? The actual pitching, the follow-up, the scheduling, the communication with the host, um, and even that the ask at the end of it for um for the link as well. Um, so there's a lot, there's a lot to it. It's very much incorporating all of the pieces that lend itself to that persistence that we were talking about so that you have an effective, efficient, and sustainable pitching workflow, right? That works for you, not against you.

SPEAKER_01: 31:25

Awesome. And if you could give one piece of

SPEAKER_02: 31:29

advice to someone out there right now listening to this going oh I want I want to do this I know this is what I need to do but I just I'm scared I don't feel if I'm I don't feel like I'm ready I don't feel like I'm good enough what would that one piece of advice before anything especially if it's new especially if it's new if it's something new and and you haven't can you start that over because you froze for a second oh yeah absolutely sorry about that what I was saying is um no one ever feels ready right no one ever feels ready it's one of those things where if you've never done it before it's outside of your comfort zone then you're it's it's unfamiliar for you so the biggest piece of advice that I can say if you're feeling that fear or that resistance or anything something is holding you up is make create safety for it. And what do I mean by that is it goes back to self-care nervous system regulation, right? If you resonate with that. But essentially what I say the easiest thing for me and what I even tell my clients is go back to your breath. Create safety with whatever you're about to do with your breath. So breathe take action breathe again the more you take the action the more you're going to grow comfort in that and the confidence will build around that but you have to start somewhere.

SPEAKER_01: 32:43

Absolutely I love that thank you so much for coming on and talking about this. I think it's so important and I don't think there are enough people out there talking about how to promote yourself and how to pitch yourself. Yet it is such an important part of growing your business.

SPEAKER_02: 33:00

It really is it really is it's it's that exposure and it's casting the net I always say it's casting the net wide but targeted right so really making sure that it's not just any podcast or any collaboration that you're seeking but it's the right fit that's aligned for you, your your your audience and also with your goals and what lights you up. It it's so important that it needs whatever visibility strategy you're looking for, it's got to light you up.

SPEAKER_00: 33:29

Absolutely thank you so much. And I will make sure to link all of Kim's information down in the description please reach out to her. She's fabulous and until next time keep on planning like a boss